Quote of the Day

[kalibex]

"...if one wants to be happy, one should not focus on trying to become happy directly, but should try to act morally, and happiness will come as a side effect."
-Elliot Temple

Comments? Criticisms?

Comments

[nexstarman.livejournal.com]

Happiness is definitely a side-effect. But what does it mean to act morally?

[kalibex.livejournal.com]

In such a way as to produce (more/the most) happiness?

Uh-oh...is that a circular argument?

[nexstarman.livejournal.com]

Ain't Socrates great? ;-)

[drake57.livejournal.com]

The real question is what is "Happy"
I don't think it can be defined so i can't agree with the quote

[samantha2074.livejournal.com]

For many of the things I do, such as playing the horn, morality seems sort of irrelevant, yet the activity still brings me joy. How does the above account for that? Also, I can imagine that you could behave completely morally, but not be happy, because you've limited the scope of your life.

Frankly, I have a deep mistrust of any philosophy that can be easily encapsulated. I don't think the world is that simple.

[drake57.livejournal.com]

Many "moral" can be the un-happiest folks you could ever run into
I agree with you the world is not that simple

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

You could insert a number of words in where 'morally' is. I do think it's a mistake to just go 'looking for happiness'... you have an idea of what you're looking for, so when the real thing comes to you, you miss it and it's gone.

So yeah, I agree... you just live, and do stuff, and follow your heart. Happy moments will come to you and you'll appreciate them, whereas if you go questing for them you'll never be satisfied with the moments you get.

Note that I said 'moments'... people who go hunting for happiness have this idea that it's a final and permanent state to reach, like nirvana. As long as you're alive you'll have happy moments and sad ones, and the way you live your life can increase the number of happy ones or make you cherish them more.

[kalibex.livejournal.com]

Hmm, point - but I notice you put 'moral' in quotes - it may be those people are not truely moral...?

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

It's not a circular argument from a religious standpoint... you could call it karma, or the Christian perspective is just that people who do good will be rewarded either through worldly things or inner peace. Doing good creates good.

More practically... within certain limits, doing good things for other people makes you feel good, but doing too much for others means neglecting yourself. The balance is in a different place for everyone.

People who live 'morally' but are nasty people anyways are probably being moral because they've been told to (by a holy book or by parents or something), and not because they really want to. They've been told by someone else that the balance should be this much, when if left to their own devices they'd put it somewhere else.

[drake57.livejournal.com]

yeah moral in quotes for the blind faith moral types
to me moral is more of being nice to fellow humans and helping without being asked not being moral to get your way into heaven (this applies to all religions)
I just don't see those "moral" folks being happy,some of them think happiness is a sin

Hmmm...

[taewakan.livejournal.com]

I think indefatigable42 may have a point about happiness.
Of course, morality isn't actually about happiness.
It is about appeasing deity.
Bacchus is a wonderful deity for irreverent morality.
Jehovah, on the other hand, was REALLY into keeping his people PURE.
Survival and ethnic purity. Sounds very middle eastern to me.

Darwinian morality is also about survival, but the Unitarian (or was that Utilitarian? sigh) POV suggests the greatest happiness for the greatest number is the one true way. (Pass the chinese please.)

Personally, I think different people and cultures have different needs in this area. Needs that may change with time and circumstances.
Absolutes are for places like heaven and hell.
Me?
I am living here and now.
This NOW is wonderful because for the first time in my life, I feel like I have choices between lesser and greater goods.
I think Buddha was right - Life is about enduring (vs. the popular translation - suffering.)

Three minutes... and counting!

[random-c.livejournal.com]

It's twaddle. You can try your best to always be nice to people and you end up underpaid, undervalued, and alone in a filthy flat on a saturday night, with nobody wanting to talk to you unless they're after something. Oh and possibly suffering with clinical depression.
What makes you happy is... well things which make you happy. Friends (the sort who hear the screams you don't let out) being around, things you like to read, food you enjoy...

Re: Hmmm...

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

Morality and 'being good' in organized religion are done with the purpose in mind of pleasing the deity and getting oneself into a nice apartment in the afterlife. It always comes with that promise, of being happy either during your life or after you die... which seems to be just crowd-control. It's about keeping the people in order, not actually asking them to be good to others for the others' sake. It's still just looking out for yourself.

Re: Hmmm...

[taewakan.livejournal.com]

Even karma is like that - what goes around comes around. You aren't actually being *good* per se for the sake of being good, but to avoid having bad stuff come back to you.
I am not certain that I believe in morality.
i believe in being what you are - karma be damned. How else do you learn who you are and what you truly want?

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

Thought of something else, from the non-religious position. Acting 'morally' just means that your actions reflect your sense of right and wrong, and you can certainly have that sense without being religious. If you try to do what's right, you might have a higher probability of being happy down the road-- because it's hard to be happy if you feel guilty about having done something that went against your moral code.